Tonight on This Week.

Tony Blair in the dock as the Iraq y -- as the Iraq inquiry reaches fever pitch.

Rory Bremner makes his Lewis Hamilton preparations.

AS TONY BLAIR honestly, I need this inquiry like a hole in the head.

It is a busy enough week as it is.

Working for the bank and for the European.

. Little pigs, let me come And think think think, Armando Iannucci, tells us what we have learned of the blier style of government.

Legal advice, nought, experts, sidelines and objectors silenced.

Sir John Chilcott's and a culture of secrecy wider than Andy Murray's mouth.

Somebody has made a poo on my desk.

I want it cleaned up.

bum is clean, it is clean as a whistle.

And Rod Liddle reports, as the economy splutters into lie, he reports on the election lines.

Clear!

Who would you trust to empty your bed pan and dress your wounds?

Dr Brown or Dr Cameron?

As David Cameron's campaign poster becomes a national joke, art critic, Sarah Thornton reflects on our new-found passion for street art.

Party politics rarely makes good art.

Too narrow and too parochial.

Evening, all.

Welcome to They Week, a week in which we learned that the British economy is out of recession.

() well, sort Not so you would notice.

More of a rounding error than a bounce.

Yes, the UK managed to grow at the blistering pace of 0 .1% of 2009.

That was before the big freeze and the hike in VAT and credit cards maxed out during Christmas, so we have no money left and the ending of the car scrappage scheme.

So God knows what it will look out when the next figures come out, two weeks before the date of the general election.

No wonder the Treasury has been given workers advice on how to combat stress.

At lease they don't have a boss who hurls office equipment across the office.

At Tescos in Cardiff, they have had to put up a sign asking customers not to tonne up bare foot in their PJs, what do they do in Cardiff?

It is enough to make you get away from it all, do a runner, maybe?

Last week's guest, Lady Sovereign, where are you?

We have been looking everywhere.

You disappeared.

We are taking no chance this week.

Firmly chained to each other, indeed to each other, Diane Abbott and Michael Portillo.

Diane, your moment of the week?

was amaze to discover that Adam Crozier, who used to run the Post Office is now to run ITV.

He has been paid over \xC2\xA31 million a year, it has the worst industrial relations ever together with archie Norman, who ran Tescos when the food was rubbish.

Didn't he run ASDA?

Yes, maybe, but it was all rubbish.

He was a Tory MP, sorry, a failed Tory MP.

I would like to say that the food in Tescos is superb and also the food in ASDA's, Diane has no taste.

That has probably saved us about \xC2\xA31 million.

Michael?

This week, obviously, a lot of people are looking for work, employers…

Including you!

Employers are advertising with Job Centres, they are there to give people employment.

Apparently a person put in an advertisement in the Job Centre asking for a reliable worker, turned down by the Job Centre that it zis criminated against unreliable workers.

No!

You are making it up?

No, I'm not.

It is like the story of Tesco's and the PJs and the bare feet.

We have so little rigour, so little expectation of anybody, anything goes.

It is political correctness gone mad.

I love it.

In just under ten hours begins the most eagerly anticipated political event of the year, not the general election, tomorrow is the day that Tony Blair descends from one of his many houses to appear before the Iraq inquiry.

We're in for a special treat, my friends.

Six whole hours of questions.

Not even JP Morgan can afford that sort of face time with our former Prime Minister and for us it is free.

We pondered long and hard about how to talk to about this momentous event.

Then we thought, go to the top.

Why not just ask the man himself, yes, This Week has been granted exclusive access as Mr Blair makes the final preparations for his

What have you done today to make you feel proud.

It's never too late to try

What have you done today to make you feel proud.

You know, preparing for the inquiry tomorrow, I thought I would have a look at the old speeches, this is a great one.

The first mop as the Prime Minister, in Paris, so jet-lagged.

Here it is "mine is the first generation, able to couldn't plait the possibility that we may live our entire lives without going to war or sending our children to war" crikey, what was I thinking of, mad?

! You know, honestly, I need this inquiry like a hole in the head it is a busy enough week, working for a bank, an insurance company and a hedge fund.

Now these guys want, what?

Six hours of my time?

Come on, guys, if this was a private company, you would note get change out of half a million and all of it is Gordon's fault.

Why agree to the inquiry in the first place.

This stuff happened, like, ages ago, who cares?

Move on.

Still, since they invited me it is the least I can do to turn up.

Really, I checked, but if you have to do something like this, you have to get good, legal advice.

Cos a lawyer can give you Anne you want.

You know, how do you think we got permission to invade in the first place.

I asked cherie, she said I can't afford her.

I think that she will find find that I can.

So here are the killer lines of defence.

1: Divine intervention.

It is simple, God said that the war was fine.

George Bush asked him, God said it was fine.

I am soifr -- sorry, you can't argue with that.

Two: Blame the public.

They voted for me, under our system, they get to vote every five years, inbetween I get to do what I like.

I'm sorry, that's democracy and a lot of people decide in -- died in Iraq to have democracy.

We made sure of that.

Besides, I had my fingers crossed!

Three: Practicality.

As George Bush said, you're either for us or against us.

For a lot of practical reasons it makes more sense to invade Iraq than it does to invade America.

I mean, Doh!

Four: On WMD : No smoke without fire.

Although, of course, the weapons inspectors never found smoke, that merely confirms that Saddam Hussein had already developed smokeless fire.

Five: Influence.

Who do you want to impress most?

Clare Short or Condoleezza Rice?

Sixth: This is the real kicker, mistaken identity.

The Tony Blair you want was on \xC2\xA31 50,000 a year a public servant, therefore, accountable, whereas me, I'm on about \xC2\xA360 million, a totally different person, I'm my own boss, I don't give a monkey what anybody thinks, accept for God, of course, and I'm a Catholic now so also the Pope, so there.

Now, I know they will ask me thou is that I describe intelligence, that was sporadic, patchy and limited as "extensive, detailed and authorative" my answer to that, well, I would like to hear my answer to that, but we are all forgetting, Saddam Hussein has gone, that is literally all that matters.

As we have shown, the UN, it doesn't matter, the international law, it doesn't matter, the Cabinet doesn't matter, David Kelly doesn't matter, Parliament doesn't matter, so you have to ask the question, does Chilcot matter, does the inquiry matter, come on, face, bothered?

So what have you done to me to make me feel proud.

And we are joined by the right honourable Tony Blair doing an impercent nation of Rory Bremner!

Should you not be preparing?

I know, of course.

If we invaded Iraq, suddenly, they all headed in there, the suicide bombers, the car bombers, we would have them on toast, but you could not say that, nobody would is believed him!

And we are joined by Armando Iannucci from the man behind The Thick Of It.

Good to see you too.

What do you make of the huge anticipation, we are doing our best to Stoke it.

Absolutely, as everyone says it is a moment, there has always been a suspicion that the Sir John Chilcott inquiry may yet turn out to yet another whitewash.

So far they have done a very good job of trying to undermine that by getting more of the facts out, telling the Government to go away when they tried to make it secret, however they have held back from asking a lot of killer questions, most of the witnesses have said when asked a killer question, that is for you to ask Mr Blair.

So tomorrow is the opportunity for those questions to be answered.

He is the only person to answer them.

Also, Goldsmith, the interesting thing there, was what on earth happened?

He did not give an explanation.

He didn't explain what changed his mind.

There, with Falkland Islands and Baroness Morgan.

He was slapped He was slapped around.

I think it's going to be an anticlimax.

I think this has been a good inquiry despite itself.

Gordon was never meant to give evidence.

They are not forensic interviewers.

There's only one that's really good.

What kind of performance do you expect tomorrow?

Confident, madge steerial, I don't think these guys are likely to lay a finger on him.

I no.

think the threage ektive question is the biggest question.

Aye a heretic on the question on the legal advice, the legal advice on international law is made up by the guys in the Foreign Office as they go along.

For example, none of the advice that the Prime Minister was getting against the war was advice being given to the United States against the war.

There are people in the Foreign Office who want to make - No.

Who want to make - American lawyers have a view is that if the president wants to do something that make it's legal.

That's a very different view.

we come back to Tony Blair rather than getting up the legal question.

On that point, it's interesting that Tony Blair, but Jack Straw, who's been interesting in all this.

He's been coming across as though I always had my doubts.

Absolutely.

He's like the one trying to put out the Foreign Office advice.

Foreign Office lawyer said well he said it was illegal.

He said well I did lots of things that were illegal and we won in the courts.

That's interesting question about how powerful the inquiry will be.

That evidence about Jack Straw dismissing the unanimous legal advice from foreign advisors only came out the week after Jack Straw himself had given a day of evidence.

Implying that he had grave doubts too.

It didn't come out in the questioning.

Does chill cot had the power to call Jack Straw back?

you think we will learn anything Tony Blair Blair will say "I believe it was the right thing do.

-- to do.

I -- it would be refreshing for him to say it was the wrong thing to do.

Apparently he's been practising to 2am.

He's get round it.

The interesting thing is what he said to Vanessa Feltz.

He told Parliament exactly the opposite that if Saddam gave up the weapons of mass destruction he would be welcome to stay in office.

Let's keep the record straight Fern Briton.

Another apology!

Is it true to say that those hoping to see Blair kippered and there are many who are, are going to be disappointed?

Yes.

The inquiry is in the a trial.

They're not designed to be putting people on the spot as if they're on Mastermind.

They are about trying to uncover the facts.

And really the killer points about the inquiry only come afterwards, when you piece together something that was said one day with something that was said three weeks ago and try to spot the similarities or the contraductions.

It comeles out inadvertantly.

The heart of this is how it came about.

It goes back to what you're doing in the Thick Of It.

I was looking at Robin Cook's autobiography.

He felt that Blair was almost amazed that he got to this point where they were going to go to war.

There was nobody who really challenged him.

Goldsmith said he turned up in Cabinet and first thing he had written this 13- page letter to Blair and the Cabinet were never shown that.

They were shown two sides of A4.

As Goldsmith said, because he was in the room and he said well the war is legal.

He said there is another point of view, he said at that point the discussion fell away.

I mean what do they do, is that everything?

Well let's play bingo right.

On its own 1441.

It tells us that the inquiry is revealing the style of Government.

The Mandarins who are appearing are complaining about the style of Government, aren't they?

They are now.

They didn't at the time.

The Mandarins are at least as culpable for everything that's happened in the style of Government as Blair.

only person who comes out with credit is it Elizabeth Wilmhurst.

We are learning about the style of Government even more.

Civil servants, mandarins, those who run querries are genetically programmed not to question the purpose of the establishment.

Does the word huton come to mind in that context?

Everyone regards Huton and the Government would say it was final prove that they did nothing wrong.

If you examine the evidence that came beforehand, it painted a completely different picture.

Simply, -- similarly, with the Butler Review.

He said when he was challenged because everything was in his inquiry, but he came, he pulled his punchs in the conclusion.

He said, it is not my role to bring down governments.

His attitude was that he had given all we needed in the append ices.

Blair's view was strategic.

He decided on 9/11 that he would stand alongside the United States come what may.

That is in a way a perfectly respectable decision.

It is so say that Britain's proper place is to be with the world's greatest democracy.

Even if America invaded democracy?

Yes, that's the context.

He didn't say that in the House of Commons.

What he said to us over and over is there are weapons of mass destruction.

Which means, if Michael's true, that means that he never gave us the real reason for taking us to war.

He lied.

reasons, as they gave way, the weapons of mass destruction, there was regime change, there was the humanitarian argument, each of those who they snapped he had to fall back on something else.

He committed himself.

The fundamental thing he committed himself fully and early.

Nothing else was going to get in the way of that.

He will argue that he believe today was the right thing to do and that he believed it was the right thing dodo -- to do.

Surely Government has to be more than belief or faith.

Even when the evidence was against it, there was nobody standing up in Cabinet.

It was wrong.

officials were weak.

He would argue he prayed about it and he believe it's Wass the right thing to do.

That's the same argument Al-Qaeda use.

When the rational gave away, he came the closest to apologising at conference, he said knowledge isn't the same as facts, I only know what I believe, which is actually the opposite of how impeerical enquire require has conducted itself for 3,000 years.

You find evidence and then make conclusions from the evidence.

thought Rory's point in the film, it was obviously intended as a joke, there's a serious point, which is I was elected and I do what I want once I'm elected.

Remember he got a majority in Parliament.

I think at the time of the invasion he still had majority of public opinion in the opinion polls.

Many, many people have peeled off along the way, he's left there in the witness stand.

He wasn't elected as president and commander in chief.

No, it's not the American thing.

I make the extra point he went to Parliament, he didn't want to, he went Parliament and public opinion polls were on his side.

A lot of arms were twisted to get that point.

Cherie rang people to get them to vote for her husband.

A lot of people voted in Parliament who say they wouldn't have voted if they'd known.

That's my point they have the privilege of changing their mind, whereas Blair is stuck with his view.

A lot of people supported the war because they believed that there were weapons of mass destruction.

No some people genuinely believe today.

They believed it was a plan to make Iraq a better place.

Both these things turned out not to be true and how much did he know they weren't true at the time.

Labour MPs who voted for him who genuinely thought he's the Prime Minister, how can he be lying.

In the grand scheme of things, will Chilcot matter?

It's hard to tell, isn't it?

It is hard to tell.

It's difficult to land a punch on Tony Blair.

The two things are, I don't think if Blair had this over again he'd want it to play out the same way.

He can't admit it.

If he did, it would, the way it went about, the point I made in the film, he will say I did the right thing and Saddam is gone.

But the UN was side lined.

Law as the Foreign Office defined it was side lined.

You had the Kelly thing.

Cabinet were side lined.

All those things happened before and afterwards such a mess was made of the recovery…

It's darkened his 11 years in Downing Street.

It's made it more difficult of intervention to happen elsewhere.

The plan for restoration and rebuilding was appalling and not there.

Are we looking for closure on the Blair years with this?

heavens.

I think it would be wrong to think that Chilcot will have mattered.

It all depends on what kind of clon collusion Chilcot draws from the evidence.

There's a possible outcome, Michael aluelded to it, which will not please a lot of people who want to see him held to account, which is his performance will be so brilliant, because he's articulate and smart, people will say wow he was a class act.

I kind of miss him.

Isn't that a danger?

He is David Blaine in political form.

Nobody misses him more than Rory I think.

They can always vote Cameron because he does a better impression than I do.

public isn't as, a lot of the public have made up their mind about Tony Blair.

They think that he was a liar.

Chilcot won't matter but the evidence will tell.

opinion hasn't changed since I met him in 1997.

He asked to be interviewed by Alan partridge and Steve Cougan and I went to the conference and wrote a ten minute sketch for Blair and Steve and Alan partridge to perform together.

He only had ten mintoits lock at the script.

I was nervous.

He had to get the wording right.

He went through it, looked at Alastair Campbell after each joke to make sure it was fine.

Went out and did it word perfect.

He should have struted on the boards.

Fantastic actor.

He did strut the boards.

did.

I hope it's closure, because those teeth really hurt.

What was it like, twaz nostalgic dressing up?

It was.

But it felt like the past.

He's back for one more day in the spotlight.

Did you feel evil?

Yes, but only when I was in character.

Thank you very much.

Now no sneaking off to bed or you'll miss this, yes we're critiquing art, street art and the new national pastime of defacing call me Dave's shiny advicage with Sarah Thornton.

If this programme makes you want to deface your TV, and we know it does, we can't blame you, why not tell us about it, by visiting the website.

Can you sign up to our award-losing news letter.

Or you could just deface or Twitter page.

I know I do.

Now, this was the week the economy was supposed to roar back into life.

Everybody predicted it, even us, which should have been a warning, since we're always wrong.

As it was we managed a pathetic 0.

1, yes 0.

1%, to compound the agony one of those nice American fund managers said our public debt, of which there is rather a lot, was as explosive as nitroglycerine.

It's just as well the political parties got round to spelling out how this week they'd get us out of our financial coma and when.

Well, sort of.

Actually they didn't really do it at all.

Who better than Rod Liddle to convey the economic pain.

I dreamed a dream in time gone by…

I live!

I live.

I wasn't dead after all.

Just in a persistent vegetative state.

No change there, then.

Now the recession is over, now I can feel the green shoots springing up.

0.

1% growth, well it's a start I suppose.

Better than poor Mr Hungary down the corridor or dying Mrs Spain next door.

One of my doctors, Dr Dave, says the best way to treat me is cut off life support entirely and to send the defibbery lator to the rental company.

The longer you leave it, the worse it gets.

We know that from our own lives.

It's the same for the Government.

That's why we're saying today that the next step the Government has to take is to say we have to make some progress in 2010.

I have to say it's in stark contrast to the nice Dr Gordon, who wishs to lavish money on this undead corpus of mine regardless of whether it does any good.

We must reduce deficits steadily according to a plan, but that we must do nothing this year which would put recovery, growth and jobs at risk near Britain and Bad things were happening while I slept.

The security threat in the country was raised from substantial to severe, no-one knew what this meant and there was no explanation.

Security Minister Lord West was summoned to the Home Affairs Select Committee, he seemed as baffled as the rest of us.

I think that the average individual living in his vicarage in deeper England knows very little.

I still think that I don't think we should tell them if JTAC assesses there is a greater threat.

Harriet did a passable imitation of the young dead this week.

Meanwhile, the crusading William Hague, insisted that the government should get tougher with the banks.

We have the biggest budget deficit in peacetime history, the largest bank bail-out, the weakest recovery in the G20 and doesn't she think it is time to back some of the proposals of the United States to sort out the banks in the future?

When he was sitting in the Cabinet, there were double the number of repossessions.

When he was in government, there was three times as many brupgsis.

When he was in government in recession, there was four times as many job losses.

I have to say, that his reversing is even worse than mine.

Vince Cable shoved the scalpel deep into the heart of New Labour.

Can she explain why now, after 12 years of Labour government, inequlities are the same, still shocking wealth in equallities in shares and properties are worse and as we discovered this week, child poverty is now growing.

Thanks.

What a thrill it was to wake up and find Northern Ireland back in the news.

Dr Brown, I have come to heal, he said, but they are still snarling at one another, playing with tin whistles and rosary baeds.

Maybe Brown would have thought he would have better whruk Yemen and Afghanistan, especially after we have given those moderate people lots of money and jobs.

. Have to turn the tide in the fight against the insurgency and in supporting the Afghan government in winning the trust of the people.

And if you ever needed a real deep- clean, and reassure the woman, that she stood defiant in the Chilcot inquiry, to ensure that the war in Iraq was legal or not, it wasn't, she had a few words with Lord Goldsmith.

The safest route was to ask for a second resolution, we were talking about the massive invasion of another country, the changing of a government, and the occupation of that country, and in those circumstances it did seem to me that we ought to follow the safest route…

But it was clear that the Attorney-General general was not go to stand in the way of government But no-one brazening it out like Lord Goldsmith.

Had he come under even a teensy weensy bit of pressure to change his mind about the legality the war in Iraq?

No, not at all.

He just happened to be the only lawyer in the country that thought it was legal.

It was alleged that you were more or less pinned to the wall with those when had allegedly formed a pinser movement on you and told you what Blair wanted, would you like to comment on that?

Absolutely complete and utter nonsense.

Tomorrow it is Tony Blair.

I don't think I can stand it.

You know, I think I was better off before…

Doctor?

Come and turn these machines off, I've had enough.

I dream.

Rod Liddle in our little BBC Hospital, where he is being well-cared for, before he gets sectioned.

Now, are you surprised by the terrible economy figures?

No, I think there is worse to come.

I have said several times, I think there could be a big event coming along.

I keep asking people whether the British deficit is refundable, people say that we will probably get downrated.

It will be more expensive dds --…

Interest rates will be going up?

Yes, the total national debt this year is going to be 72% of the GDP.

That is a lot of money.

Imagine the interest rates going up half a per crept or 1% 2 percent.

That is really serious money.

Money not available to spend on the national health service and education.

I think it will be a horrific year ahead of us.

You last week talked about the possibility of a double dip.

It has come on to the agenda of the papers this morning, saying that the double dip is now a real concern, that we could go back into recession?

It is possible, but Gordon Brown needs for the trend to be in the right direction.

There is no trend?

It is within the bounds of error to be fair.

He needs for people to be feeling OK, for people to have confidence in him, not George Osborne.

But it is a terrible indictment of government and economic possible, - - policy, after a massive printing of money, substantial deappreciations of sterling, the lowest interest rates in history and the biggest fiscal deficit in the advanced world, that all it can do is 0 .1%.

They would argue that the figure is on the turn.

That's it?

That's what they would argue.

We could be revised down?

They're hoping that will not happen.

Really?

When I was secretary of Treasury, people would ask me to forecast the future, I could not even forecast the past as the figures were already revised.

But there is nothing else that this government can do.

It has to turn off the printing press, it can't borrow more, the markets will go spare it can't cut interest rates any more, if it continues to see sterling go down, then inflation will pick up.

They are talking about printing money.

There is still talk of even more quantitative easing, that is going on, but many of the moves that the Government is committed to make this year will take us in the other direction.

Remember, taxes are to go up to 5%.

VAT has gone up.

If that figure coming out on April the 26th, ten days before the election shows that we have slid back into election then then quarter is curtains?

All bets are off.

But let's hope that the figure is the right way.

What matters is how the general public feels.

They will be feeling miserable?

not because they see the figures but they will know that they will have less money this year.

Let's move on to Afghanistan.

There was a big conference in London.

Hamid Karzai was talking about us being in Afghanistan for another ten years, that must have pleased Gordon Brown.

He said ten or is a years, you could hear Gordon Brown go white.

That is not what he wants.

He wants the British to have the impression we can come out in a year or so.

Is there a chance that this venture will be a success?

I don't think so.

After 9/11 we put the Taliban in its backs for quite a period of time.

This second phase, this Helmand phase has been a new campaign.

What happened is that when we first went into Afghanistan we had a lot of allies on the ground, which had the Northern Alliance on our side.

We seem to have thrown that away.

We have driven so many factions into the arms of the Taliban, what we need is a much more intelligent policy, where we begin to get factions on our side.

I had a former government minister on the Daily Politics, saying we have to tackle the root causes of poverty in Afghanistan.

If you can do that in England, we can't even do that there!

We don't even know how to tackle the root poverty in Glasgow, how do we do it?

This is to do with giving proper respect to the tribal leaders who have control in the areas.

They have been neglected we tried to set up a centralised state.

It has never been centralised.

Let me move on.

What is it that the Labour Party is about if not about reducing inequality?

Well, I would agree with that It was just a question?

I know, aagree with you.

When Harriet commissioned the report it was to give a push to that…

But, Diane, you would like to believe that these people have been in power for the last 12 and 13 years, failing to do Labour things it is not true.

They have done Labour things and the Labour thing has failed.

Nobody has tried harder to redistribute wealth than Gordon Brown, it does not work.

That is what the Tories are saying now.

It is interesting, as the groups income that has really slipped is the single mums.

It is pretty depressing to find out that inequality is even worse now than it was when the woman you hate was in Downing Street?

The trend started under her.

But you have had 13 years to stop the trend, 13.

We didn't reverse it.

Is there anything in the Tory locker to make a difference?

Education.

That is long-term.

Yes, but if you take money from one person and give it to another, it will not help, but if you help these people to climb the ladder thank then you can achieve something.

Can I ask the question is that the same Rod Liddle who was charged Charged…

Diane does not always know what see is saying, she is not on her medication tonight, we will deal with her later.

Now, we read each and everyone of the comments on the show carefully before carefully filing them away and settling fire to the filing Cabinet, it saves on heating bills if a politician can dodge an e-mail or an angry constituent, it seems that they cannot avoid public opinion on their billboards.

Yes, the billboards have been vandalised.

We are not opponenting fingers, so, the writing is on the wall as we It may have started?

The ghetto and been embraced by the art world, now, graffiti has been embraced by the Conservatives.

If you can't get the photograph right it is difficult to get the policies right as well.

Art has been increasingly politicise by the likes of Banksy, his documentary premiered at the Sun Dance Film Festival.

Now the public are getting in on the street art themselves.

Sticking the fingers up on the campaigns meant to woe them.

So whether it is street art, or Photoshopped savagery, what is the meaning of this politics?

We are joined by Sarah Thornton an arts journalist, welcome to This Week.

Can this kind of graffiti we have been seeing on the David Cameron poster, can it be described as street art?

No, I don't think so.

Just graffiti!

It has something in common with artists like Banksy, he uses a term of brandallism.

So that specifically targets advertising campaigns, there is an affinity there, but it not as thetically sensitive, thought- provoking for a few moments, and it is not intended to be art.

It could win the Turner Prize?

doubt it.

Is there a relationship between art and politics?

I think that a lot of us are engaged with politics in a broad sense, maybe gender, race and environmentallism, but few engage with party politics.

It was interesting to watch what was going on in the art world during the American campaign, because there were a phenomenal number of portraits of Barack Obama made by artists of all kinds.

I doubt we are to see that here in the next year.

I don't think that David Cameron and Gordon Brown really inspire that mousse-like…

artistic spark.

I think you may be right.

I don't want to go out on a limb, but I think you may be right.

Was the original David Cameron image a mistake?

I think it is true, I think you are barking up the wrong tree in talking about this as art.

It is more journalism.

There are a lot of words involved, a lot of wit involved, a lot of puning.

The puning is undermining the value of the poster in the first place.

Undermining the image of David Cameron?

Yes, but this is more in the field of commentary, than it is in the field of art and quite effective.

There was that white space, an invitation to a graffiti artist, but I'm not sure that I agree when you say that artists don't engage in politics, Picasso's greatest painting was Guernica…

But party politics more specifically it is a more narrow field of politics, but he was commissioned by the Spanish Government to do that mural, it is a masterpeice.

There are important exception.

It is fun to see, I know there are websites where you ka go on the poster and colour it in and do your own drawings, that is great fun, but there is a danger for David Cameron, at a time when things are not go well, in becoming a figure of fun.

That is the last thing he wants?

He is taking a big risk by milking -- making himself suf a figure.

You know why he is doing that?

His polls show, the interesting thing is that the Labour Party is more popular than Mr Brown and the Conservative Party is less pom lar than Mr Cameron.

I understand that, so he has to lead and be a presidential figure, but it is another move to colour Britain in posters of yourself.

You could have covered Britain in posters of a slogan without a picture of yourself.

That There is an echo of celebrity culture.

And having it air-brushed.

British people are sceptical about celebrity culture, that is how he has gotten tripped up.

Is it a trend, will every poster be defaced in some way?

That is a tough one.

Perhaps in David Cameron is featured so prominently on them, that is a possibility.

I think it will be hard to avoid.

The boot of British people, it is an anti-politics gesture of British people to do that?

And also, how this internet is leading to the eggs explosion -- explosion of creativity.

You could not have had this with the internet.

That is all for tonight, folks, we are off to get a good night's slip,